Stronger "strains" and BD discussions
- Dizkuz
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Stronger "strains" and BD discussions
Hi there Andrew
I had a talk to a friend of my and he ask me if there are any hybrids "strains " that are much stronger than other once. he asked me about pigeon, if they where more robust than other ones, i remember when i started with discus and i have heard the something. but didnt believe there where any truth in that... but i know there are some "strains" consider as weaker once, as for a example Albino, Golden, and if i dont remember it wrong, even blue diamond where weaker when they just mutated...
So is there any strain that are more stronger than other when it comes to diseases and environment do you think?
Brgds Danne
I had a talk to a friend of my and he ask me if there are any hybrids "strains " that are much stronger than other once. he asked me about pigeon, if they where more robust than other ones, i remember when i started with discus and i have heard the something. but didnt believe there where any truth in that... but i know there are some "strains" consider as weaker once, as for a example Albino, Golden, and if i dont remember it wrong, even blue diamond where weaker when they just mutated...
So is there any strain that are more stronger than other when it comes to diseases and environment do you think?
Brgds Danne
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Poff!
- Tommy
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- Dizkuz
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Re: Stronger "strains"
Andrew
No point of view on this quesstion
No point of view on this quesstion
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Poff!
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Re: Stronger "strains"
Sorry Danne,
I just received notification on this thread today.
Tommy, you are right, very interesting question
Yes Sir, there are mutations that are generally weaker. Take fishes like the SnakeSkin. Even up to date with so many crosses with Snakeskin gene, those discus are generally weaker. And in the first generation of snakeskins, the hatching also takes longer than other strains. While others take only 60 hours to hatch, Snakskin eggs take any time from 72 to 84 hours to hatch. But as time passed and crossing with other strains, this genetic trait of SS which is not a reecessive characteristic may not be expressed in the some of the modern day SS crosses discus....but there are still snakeskin varieties that hatch after 72 hours.
Another such is Snow white. It was a very weak mutation and looked sickly. Up to today, crosses with other strains have strengthen the gene but they are still weaker than most other strains. BUt then again, surprisingly, this SW strain phenotypic expression is extremely dominant. Whatever strain you cross with the SW, a percentage of SW gene will be expressed in the FI.
AS to Blue Diamond, it is all the while quite strong....as far as I know. Pigeons are also tough guys. Albinos are the weakest in the modern day discus especially the rabbit eyes type still are the weakest.
Hope that answers your doubt.
Thanks and take care,
Andrew
I just received notification on this thread today.
Tommy, you are right, very interesting question
Yes Sir, there are mutations that are generally weaker. Take fishes like the SnakeSkin. Even up to date with so many crosses with Snakeskin gene, those discus are generally weaker. And in the first generation of snakeskins, the hatching also takes longer than other strains. While others take only 60 hours to hatch, Snakskin eggs take any time from 72 to 84 hours to hatch. But as time passed and crossing with other strains, this genetic trait of SS which is not a reecessive characteristic may not be expressed in the some of the modern day SS crosses discus....but there are still snakeskin varieties that hatch after 72 hours.
Another such is Snow white. It was a very weak mutation and looked sickly. Up to today, crosses with other strains have strengthen the gene but they are still weaker than most other strains. BUt then again, surprisingly, this SW strain phenotypic expression is extremely dominant. Whatever strain you cross with the SW, a percentage of SW gene will be expressed in the FI.
AS to Blue Diamond, it is all the while quite strong....as far as I know. Pigeons are also tough guys. Albinos are the weakest in the modern day discus especially the rabbit eyes type still are the weakest.
Hope that answers your doubt.
Thanks and take care,
Andrew
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- Dizkuz
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Re: Stronger "strains"
Thank you Andrew...
Very good explaining and thanks for taking your time on this subject...
It helpt alot, confirm the myth,
Brgds Danne
Very good explaining and thanks for taking your time on this subject...
It helpt alot, confirm the myth,
Brgds Danne
No end to Karma, so we should be very careful about our actions
Poff!
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Re: Stronger "strains"
You are welcome, Danne
Any more doubt???.....ha! ha! ha!
Take care,
Andrew
Any more doubt???.....ha! ha! ha!
Take care,
Andrew
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- Dizkuz
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Re: Stronger "strains"
yes i haveAndrew Soh wrote:You are welcome, Danne
Any more doubt???.....ha! ha! ha!
Take care,
Andrew
Its another question do.. But i will shot it anyway...
In Martin Ng s book of Discus catalogue he claims that its 3 kind of solid blue that where mutated... ocean green, Blue diamond and blue cover...
Where all of them mutated and not a cross from BD at all? and what is the different in the phenotype between them? (More then the shade of color) and where goes the phenotype line between them if they where not a cross?
Please help us to clear this one out
And maybe a little history lesson about them
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- Poddan
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Re: Stronger "strains"
But you never see nice pics of BD.. well not in sweden. Well I seen one pic. thats it.
Always tought that this were an weak fish.
Always tought that this were an weak fish.
:-)
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Re: Stronger "strains"
I will post some photos of Blue diamonds tomorrow as it is late now...here in Singapore.
I don't know how Martin came to that conclusion, maybe you can check with him. I am really sorry...as I don't know how he did his research. I remembered on one topic about stress-bars, He mentioned about the different types of stress bars and he stated there were Barless, Nine Bars and 14 bars only. But it has been for a long time, way before he wrote the catalogue, that beside those few 3 bar phenotypes, there are also the existence of 6 bars, 11 bars and 21 bars phenotypes running around in the market. Just wondered why he did not include them. Most likely he was rushing and missed certain information.
The first and only blue mutation was called the Blue diamond spontaneously appeared in Hong Kong in 1990 by Low W.Y.. At the same time, my own barless full blue-color mutation also came out spontaneously around the same time and I called mine 'Pelmut discus'. IT is barless but the blue is more intense and upper and lower body were of two tones. But mine did not get popular due to some domestic problems. A while later, Malaysia bought stock from overseas, from Hong Kong through Japanese customers, one being Marina Corporation, the biggest and the hottiest buyer of Penang discus at that time and from that Malaysian Blue diamond was born and that was in 1992.
From there on, people used that blue diamond to cross and improve the scales...using very fine scaled discus of different strains to improve the smoothness of the bodily scales and Malaysians using the Cobalt to cross with Blue Diamond. Through that, finer scales and lighter body coloured Blue diamonds appeared. One of them that was concentrating on improving that smooth phenotype is Wayne of Hong Kong and he also tried to improve the body shape of his discus.
.....and it is a known fact that when you cross a barless with another strain, the barless phenotype disappear in F1 because it is recessive. And years later when the 'new' barless full colored discus with new characteristic reappear, the IGNORANT will call it a different mutation. But to me, that is an improvement of an old mutation.....something like the differences between Albino Alencer, Albino Snake and the Albino RGD we have today....they all come from the same ancestor......so ....so are Blue diamond, Pelmut discus, Blue cover, Ocean green and the many others ...including Albino Blue Diamond. You won't call 'Albino Blue Diamond' a new mutation ....do you?
Hope that explain my observation and is not to discredit Martin's view and research. Forgive me if it sounded like....that is not my intention at all. I have to be honest and diseminate what I know.
Take care,
Andrew
I don't know how Martin came to that conclusion, maybe you can check with him. I am really sorry...as I don't know how he did his research. I remembered on one topic about stress-bars, He mentioned about the different types of stress bars and he stated there were Barless, Nine Bars and 14 bars only. But it has been for a long time, way before he wrote the catalogue, that beside those few 3 bar phenotypes, there are also the existence of 6 bars, 11 bars and 21 bars phenotypes running around in the market. Just wondered why he did not include them. Most likely he was rushing and missed certain information.
The first and only blue mutation was called the Blue diamond spontaneously appeared in Hong Kong in 1990 by Low W.Y.. At the same time, my own barless full blue-color mutation also came out spontaneously around the same time and I called mine 'Pelmut discus'. IT is barless but the blue is more intense and upper and lower body were of two tones. But mine did not get popular due to some domestic problems. A while later, Malaysia bought stock from overseas, from Hong Kong through Japanese customers, one being Marina Corporation, the biggest and the hottiest buyer of Penang discus at that time and from that Malaysian Blue diamond was born and that was in 1992.
From there on, people used that blue diamond to cross and improve the scales...using very fine scaled discus of different strains to improve the smoothness of the bodily scales and Malaysians using the Cobalt to cross with Blue Diamond. Through that, finer scales and lighter body coloured Blue diamonds appeared. One of them that was concentrating on improving that smooth phenotype is Wayne of Hong Kong and he also tried to improve the body shape of his discus.
.....and it is a known fact that when you cross a barless with another strain, the barless phenotype disappear in F1 because it is recessive. And years later when the 'new' barless full colored discus with new characteristic reappear, the IGNORANT will call it a different mutation. But to me, that is an improvement of an old mutation.....something like the differences between Albino Alencer, Albino Snake and the Albino RGD we have today....they all come from the same ancestor......so ....so are Blue diamond, Pelmut discus, Blue cover, Ocean green and the many others ...including Albino Blue Diamond. You won't call 'Albino Blue Diamond' a new mutation ....do you?
Hope that explain my observation and is not to discredit Martin's view and research. Forgive me if it sounded like....that is not my intention at all. I have to be honest and diseminate what I know.
Take care,
Andrew
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Re: Stronger "strains"
So A few post deleted.
But serious..
bd.. do you have the same growth on them ?
_
But serious..
bd.. do you have the same growth on them ?
_
:-)
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